Comments on: The Middle Way (Eightfold Path) – Realistic Effort http://SkillfulMeans.lotusbell.com/2008/07/08/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort not THE way, but A way Sat, 22 May 2010 16:49:49 +0000 hourly 1 By: Dharma Voyagerhttp://SkillfulMeans.lotusbell.com/2008/07/08/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/comment-page-1/#comment-89 Dharma Voyager Wed, 09 Jul 2008 20:06:19 +0000 http://skillfulmeans.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/#comment-89 Cool... You will definitely have to share next time we see each other there... :) Cool… You will definitely have to share next time we see each other there… :)

]]> By: Una Renardhttp://SkillfulMeans.lotusbell.com/2008/07/08/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/comment-page-1/#comment-88 Una Renard Wed, 09 Jul 2008 19:29:21 +0000 http://skillfulmeans.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/#comment-88 Hahaha after reading your post I resolved to bring more loving kindness and calm into my parenting but the first round of toddler wails started an electric storm in my central nervous system. Arrrrgh! There's something about the toddler wail, the abandon...that dredges up a roiling morass of grief anger and despair. I barely managed to keep my voice even while running the peaceful conflict resolution, but I remained calm on the exterior anyway. It's a start, right? I have some pretty sl pictures of you on my hd. Namaste! Hahaha after reading your post I resolved to bring more loving kindness and calm into my parenting but the first round of toddler wails started an electric storm in my central nervous system. Arrrrgh! There’s something about the toddler wail, the abandon…that dredges up a roiling morass of grief anger and despair. I barely managed to keep my voice even while running the peaceful conflict resolution, but I remained calm on the exterior anyway. It’s a start, right?
I have some pretty sl pictures of you on my hd.

Namaste!

]]> By: Dharma Voyagerhttp://SkillfulMeans.lotusbell.com/2008/07/08/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/comment-page-1/#comment-87 Dharma Voyager Wed, 09 Jul 2008 18:03:48 +0000 http://skillfulmeans.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/#comment-87 I am glad it makes sense. Some of it seems really unintuitive to me, or just the plain opposite from how I would probably react to the situation. We were chatting last night in the discussion group, about how it is great to learn and read about this stuff, but as soon as something annoying happens it is the hardest thing to put into place. I for one can type this stuff and try to learn it, but then can I really do it... I guess the real answer so far is... as much as I can. This post was very difficult for me to post simply because I know how difficult it all is to me. The other thing is I'm no guru, I am an average joe... and this is only my interpretation of how I read it. It is helpful to me, which is why I type it out, so being that average person I think it may help out someone else out, which I think is cool. This one for example kind of opened up to me the whole positive thinking thing. Before this post I thought "positive thinking" yeah right... I'm so groovy... Your so groovy... let's hop a bus and see the sites... Well, realistic effort (endeavor) gives a little bit of framework around that type of process that really seems coherent to me. Namaste I am glad it makes sense. Some of it seems really unintuitive to me, or just the plain opposite from how I would probably react to the situation.

We were chatting last night in the discussion group, about how it is great to learn and read about this stuff, but as soon as something annoying happens it is the hardest thing to put into place. I for one can type this stuff and try to learn it, but then can I really do it… I guess the real answer so far is… as much as I can.

This post was very difficult for me to post simply because I know how difficult it all is to me. The other thing is I’m no guru, I am an average joe… and this is only my interpretation of how I read it. It is helpful to me, which is why I type it out, so being that average person I think it may help out someone else out, which I think is cool.

This one for example kind of opened up to me the whole positive thinking thing. Before this post I thought “positive thinking” yeah right… I’m so groovy… Your so groovy… let’s hop a bus and see the sites… Well, realistic effort (endeavor) gives a little bit of framework around that type of process that really seems coherent to me.

Namaste

]]> By: Una Renardhttp://SkillfulMeans.lotusbell.com/2008/07/08/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/comment-page-1/#comment-90 Una Renard Wed, 09 Jul 2008 15:07:51 +0000 http://skillfulmeans.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/#comment-90 Oh that makes perfect sense and very applicable with young faeries. Thank you for that. I have a friend who, whenever she's made to wait always says "thank you for the gift of time." It's a great way to look at it. So next time my youngest urinates on the floor, hits the poor patient cat or empties out the expensive organic liquid soap. Instead of turning into witch-mommy and bitching out my oldest I need to take a breath and appreciate that she's learning and maybe it will take her 100 lessons but it will be my kindness (or crabbiness) that she'll take with her in life. It's a difficult discipline for me these days to stay patient and calm. Thank you for this piece of wisdom that will prevent many detrimental states in the tender little faeries. Oh that makes perfect sense and very applicable with young faeries. Thank you for that. I have a friend who, whenever she’s made to wait always says “thank you for the gift of time.” It’s a great way to look at it. So next time my youngest urinates on the floor, hits the poor patient cat or empties out the expensive organic liquid soap. Instead of turning into witch-mommy and bitching out my oldest I need to take a breath and appreciate that she’s learning and maybe it will take her 100 lessons but it will be my kindness (or crabbiness) that she’ll take with her in life. It’s a difficult discipline for me these days to stay patient and calm. Thank you for this piece of wisdom that will prevent many detrimental states in the tender little faeries.

]]> By: Dharma Voyagerhttp://SkillfulMeans.lotusbell.com/2008/07/08/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/comment-page-1/#comment-92 Dharma Voyager Wed, 09 Jul 2008 03:30:37 +0000 http://skillfulmeans.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/#comment-92 I'm just learning myself, and can only give you my view from my limitations. So please take this with a grain of salt. I will try to do my best with my knowledge of "Realistic Effort" From my understanding taking up the goal of realistic effort is to attempt to decrease suffering in your life (not just work life) by reducing the number of "detrimental" states. Those detrimental states are ones in which cause actions that cause suffering to both you and others. For example... If someone "shits" on my day by giving me a vanilla latte instead of a hazelnut one, especially when I really really really wanted that hazelnut one. You know what I'm talking about here? I have a choice... I can shit on everyone else's day because of it or: 1. to prevent the arising of new detrimental states I can remember the last time I messed up something as simple as a latte, look across the counter at the new person and feel sorry for them and then leave them a tip. 2. to abandon of detrimental states that are already present I can taste the vanilla latte and think to myself that ... perhaps this is pretty good, and hazelnut can wait for tomorrow. Or I can take a breath and mention nicely that I got the wrong order, attempting not to make the person behind the counter feel like a complete idiot. 3. to cultivate beneficial states that are not yet present I can think that this place actually has really good music, and that even though out of the last 50 times I have come here, they have gotten my order perfect, today was that just first bad day. I can decide this is really no big deal and come in tomorrow for that white chocolate raspberry mocha I'm going to be hot for. 4. to maintain and perfect beneficial states already present Damn I love coffee... just feels so good on the palette.. so so so yummy... what a great start to the day It seems difficult to do, but I have to say that it does soften me a bit and has been beneficial to me. I did in a uninformed way start this in my last job, and it helped me keep a good attitude as much as I could in a unhealthy situation. You can also ask me in a week after I have started my new job. :) Let me know if I am making any sense here, and also if you think it is a complete crock of shit. -DV I’m just learning myself, and can only give you my view from my limitations. So please take this with a grain of salt. I will try to do my best with my knowledge of “Realistic Effort”

From my understanding taking up the goal of realistic effort is to attempt to decrease suffering in your life (not just work life) by reducing the number of “detrimental” states. Those detrimental states are ones in which cause actions that cause suffering to both you and others. For example…

If someone “shits” on my day by giving me a vanilla latte instead of a hazelnut one, especially when I really really really wanted that hazelnut one. You know what I’m talking about here? I have a choice… I can shit on everyone else’s day because of it or:

1. to prevent the arising of new detrimental states

I can remember the last time I messed up something as simple as a latte, look across the counter at the new person and feel sorry for them and then leave them a tip.

2. to abandon of detrimental states that are already present

I can taste the vanilla latte and think to myself that … perhaps this is pretty good, and hazelnut can wait for tomorrow. Or I can take a breath and mention nicely that I got the wrong order, attempting not to make the person behind the counter feel like a complete idiot.

3. to cultivate beneficial states that are not yet present

I can think that this place actually has really good music, and that even though out of the last 50 times I have come here, they have gotten my order perfect, today was that just first bad day. I can decide this is really no big deal and come in tomorrow for that white chocolate raspberry mocha I’m going to be hot for.

4. to maintain and perfect beneficial states already present

Damn I love coffee… just feels so good on the palette.. so so so yummy… what a great start to the day

It seems difficult to do, but I have to say that it does soften me a bit and has been beneficial to me. I did in a uninformed way start this in my last job, and it helped me keep a good attitude as much as I could in a unhealthy situation. You can also ask me in a week after I have started my new job. :)

Let me know if I am making any sense here, and also if you think it is a complete crock of shit.

-DV

]]> By: Una Renardhttp://SkillfulMeans.lotusbell.com/2008/07/08/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/comment-page-1/#comment-91 Una Renard Wed, 09 Jul 2008 01:26:36 +0000 http://skillfulmeans.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/the-middle-way-eightfold-path-right-effort/#comment-91 Please pardon my ignorant (but earnest :) questions Dharma, but I'm curious about how realistic effort might transfer into broader facets or life. Is it about the balance between work and rest in life to prevent a detrimental state? If afraid the only meditations I'm able to accomplish are the moving variety so my understanding is quite limited. Please pardon my ignorant (but earnest :) questions Dharma, but I’m curious about how realistic effort might transfer into broader facets or life. Is it about the balance between work and rest in life to prevent a detrimental state? If afraid the only meditations I’m able to accomplish are the moving variety so my understanding is quite limited.

]]>